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IELTS and ANZSCO restricting direct entry RSMS
By Liana Allan (MARN 0104178) and Kristie Morgan (MARN 1068715)
Regional employers are crying out for workers in regional areas. Regional Victoria is experiencing a lack of local talent in the following areas:
1. Hospitality - chefs and cooks
2. Diesel Mechanics
3. Fish Filleters
4. Farm workers in fruit and vegetable picking, planting and cultivation
5. Truck drivers (HGV and LGV)
Currently, the area of Gippsland, Victoria is struggling with ANZSCO codes in the agriculturual industry, as they are not reflective of the actual tasks and duties performed. Regional employers believe that ANZSCO is being applied inflexibly by DIBP case officers.
One example is the occuaption of 'Nurserypersons' where the DIBP are restricting the applicants to 'retail nurseries'. The first line of the occupation description in ANZSCO states:
NURSERYPERSONS propagate and cultivate trees, shrubs, and ornamental and flowering plants in plant nurseries.
DIBP case officers are applying 'plant nurseries' and adding in the concept of RETAIL to the definition, which knocks out persons who work in non-retail environments. The ANZSCO definition for nurserypersons does not state 'retail' in its definition.
By adding in the requirement for the position to be performed in a retail work environment, this restricts regional applicants to working in a 'retail environment'. Let's get a little bit real here. How many retail nurseries are there going to be in regional and rural Australia? Retail nurseries do not provide us with our fruit and vegetables. Wholesale nurseries do. Both require the same skill-sets. The bottom line is that the ANZSCO code for nurserypersons does not state that a person needs to work in retail. There are persons who work in large wholesale nurseries and on farms who propagate the plant from the start to the finish. Not anyone can just look after fruit and vegetables.
Now let's have a look at the occupations of Chef or Cook. If an overseas national Chef would like to apply for direct entry RSMS then at the moment they need to score 6 in each of the 4 bands on the IELTS test. A chef who is applying for direct entry should not need 6 in each band. They commonly don't need that level of English. Employers in regional areas are struggling to find people who can score this level of English. There is no incentive for chefs and cooks to look outside city areas if the IELTS test levels for rural and regional areas are exactly the same. If the whole purpose is to drive skilled workers to regional areas then the IELTS test for RSMS should be the same as the IELTS test for 457 visas in regional areas. At least that way there would be some consistency for regional and rural employers and their employees. If workers score less than IELTS band 6,6,6,6 then potentially they could move outside the metropolitan areas and score slightly less on the IELTS, applying for positions in regional and rural areas. There is currently no incentive for workers to move away from city and metropolitan areas.
As another example, a glazier does not need to score 6 in each of the 4 bands of IELTS to perform their role. One glazier we have become aware of has sat the IELTS test 13 times and has scored half a point (5.5 in one band) less than what is required for the purpose of an RSMS application. The fact that he turns 50 years old soon means that the temporary residence transition is not going to be available to him. He is an integral part of that regional business, but the employer cannot increase his salary to meet the exemption.
There has to be some incentive for overseas nationals to apply for the RSMS visa. There has to be some kind of waiver on the English requirement for direct entry. People can come in to regional areas on 457 visas and use an overall score of 5 on each band of the IELTS, or 5 years study in English. The issue is that they cannot proceed to apply for RSMS via direct entry, without evidence of IELTS level 6 in each band, unless it is a highly paid position.
There is a disconnect between level of English required for a 457 visa (IETS 5 overall with no less than 4.5 in any one component) compared to direct-entry RSMS for the same person, same position, same location and same job.
Fitting clients and their occupations / positions strictly into ANZSCO codes is restrictive. The IELTS for Regional Skilled Migration Scheme (RSMS) is restrictive.
Do any other RMAs have these sorts of problems in regional areas?
Does anyone think that the IELTS for Direct Entry is too high?
Comments
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Friday, 17 July 2015I perfectly agree. There should be IELTS exception for Regional Australia direct entry RSMS, or salary level exception for 457 . I would like to see genuine business operating in regional Queensland, that can afford paying 53900 $+ super to cook. Managers are getting less on the regional labour market, often chefs have problems to get 54K for 38 h work week . According to DIBP TSMIT threshold is set to ensure that all 457 visa holders have sufficient income to support themselves. Are the living cost the same in Sydney and Mackay ? I really doubt it. Definitely TSMIT suppose to reflect living costs differences between metropolitan and regional Australia. Why not to return to previous arrangement allowing RCB certify salary exceptions for genuine regional employers?
By the way , anyone knows why TSMIT is set at 53900 $ not for example 54321$?
Piotr Ferenc MARN 0743766 -
Friday, 17 July 2015I have the same problem with IELTS tests for chefs in regional Australia. They can perform their duties easily, but IELTS is an issue.
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Friday, 17 July 2015
I think that I would struggle with IELTS 6 and I was born and educated in Australia I have not taken the test but I have looked at the study material. I even taught English in China.
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Friday, 17 July 2015
I'm currently away from the office but I have numerous erroneous decisions from Immigration that will make you scratch your head. I've had the exact same problem with a nurseryperson and some other comical refusals such as:
1. 457 refused because the applicant didn't have a valid IELTS. The IELTS test clearly within the 3 year timeframe and the manager of the 457 section has not overturned the decision within the timeframe for my client to lodge a merits review. We're now at the MRT.
2. 457 visa application refused because there is no approved nomination in place. The nomination is still being processed and a decision hasn't even been made yet. Again, the manager refused to budge.
3. 457 visa refused because the applicant doesn't hold a Certificate IV in graphic pre-press. From my understanding, and I've had many approved with just Cert III and Diploma, there currently is no CRICOS Cert IV.
4. 457 visa application refused because the Applicant didn't have a Diploma to be a Futsol centre manager, the diploma was provided to Immigration and they've clearly overlooked it without mentioning it in the decision.
5. Nomination refused because the market rates anaylsis was apparently too old (2014). This baffles me when Immigration have agreed to keep the Tsmit the same for the next three years.
6. Nomination refused for a Sales and Marketing Manager for a company that turns over around $5 million. This was apparently not enough for a Sales and Marketing Manager.
My principal migration lawyer and myself have created a list of these decisions and even a complaint to the Commonwealth Ombudsmen has been made. Simply put, someone has instructed case officers to make quick decisions without any thought. The arrogance by Immigration and lack of liability makes it even worse. In my view, these public servants aren't qualified to be making the critical decisions that they do. All immigration employees should hold the same qualifications that RMA's have to and be made to study migration law, the whole of it. I warned my father a couple of years ago that Australia is slowly going to implement the White Australia Act again in a more subtle way. With the new military like Border Force, I believe I'm not wrong. I'm now looking at getting out of the industry. -
Friday, 17 July 2015
If ielts 6 each band, I believe no one will going to regional area. What is make it different 186 visa or 187 visa?
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Friday, 17 July 2015
As an English born person who came to Australia when I was 5 years old, and I do not have any other language than English. When I went to register as a Migration Agent late last year, I was advised that because I could not evidence attendance at secondary school, I would be required to undertake the IELTS test.
I had completed successful, an Associate Diploma, a Diploma, a Bachelor degree and the Grad Cert of Immigration Law and Practice through VU in Melbourne.
At first I thought this was a 'joke' but no!! Having undertaken and passed the IELTS test late last year..I have to say, this wasn't at all easy, lots of stress! When I entered the testing venue in Melbourne with at least 300 other students, the nervous energy in the place was sickening....well for me thankfully this is now just a distant memory but at the time, I was a wreck -
Friday, 17 July 2015
No one is actually focusing on the skills its the good looks..(IELTS) that seem to matter.
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Friday, 17 July 2015
Horticulturists? Farm Hand
Sadly since the change in the domain name it is impossible to access the ASRI list as the link no longer works.
https://immi.com.au/asri -
Friday, 17 July 2015
The problem: if you employ idiots (DIBP) you get stupid outcomes. If you then have insane politicians running the idiots you get the Australian immigration policy you deserve.
The answer: remove the politicians and replace them businessmen who will then employ intelligent people. -
Friday, 17 July 2015
The government is strongly advocating regional development in the media, but doesn't walk the talk as it implements policies that restrict just that (e.g. requiring high IELTS scores and maintaining age limitations). Globally, it does not help Australia in attracting skilled immigrants. Hopefully, the new visa system that is expected to be implemented by 01/07/2016 will address these issues.
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Friday, 17 July 2015
Multi million dollar businesses are seriously affected for refusal of nominated positions under r 5.19(4). The department's policy requirement for decision ready applications are absurd and unrealistic. On nomination submitted the case officer conjures weird or unforeseeable faulty inference and refuses the application. These COs, it seems, are not required to write and seek clarification on their flawed inference and refuse the application. This need for" decision ready " application should be scrapped and provision of the Code of Good Practice should be adhered to.
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Monday, 20 July 2015
That a transitional entry applicant only has to meet 5 in all 4 sectors belies the claim that applicants using direct entry require 6 in all 4 to carry out identical tasks. The case officers for 457 applications [sponsorship, nomination and visa] are only slightly less incompetent and just as unreasonable and illogical as those who deal with sponsored visitor and student visa applications. Unfortunately, many are also simply following instructions and flawed policy.
We should never forget that policy used to claim that the then 3 years work experience required for ENS visas meant "3 years in the last 3 years".
Ironic that the word "retail" is used to exclude both wholesale nursery persons and many customer service managers who are often deemed to be retail managers. Nearly as overworked as the default cop-out of "[not satisfied as to the] genuineness"
I too would like to see case officers have to meet the same standards as RMAs. I suspect the case officer who sent the blatantly obvious defective notification to provide further evidence with the following extract contained within would not meet any test but that of employment at DIBP. The "****INSTRUCTIONS FOR PROCESSING OFFICER..." paragraph was highlighted in red text. Maybe colour blindness might be included as a pre-requisite for visas in future!
Processing your application
I have begun considering your application for this visa and require additional information. A
summary of the information required for each applicant and a more detailed description of
each requirement is included in the attached Request Checklist and Detail attachment.
Timeframe for response
****INSTRUCTIONS FOR PROCESSING OFFICER – You MUST select one of the
Timeframe for Response options from the choice list within this letter. Failure to choose an
option will result in a defective notification being sent out.****
As this letter was sent to you by email, you are taken to have received it at the end of the day
it was transmitted.
If you do not reply within the timeframe specified above your application may be decided
without the department taking any action to obtain the requested information. If you are
unable to provide this information within this time you should contact us using the contact
details provided below. -
Monday, 20 July 2015
Scott R, in addition to the IELTS issues raised, that's a great point about age limitations! Regional areas would benefit from a higher age limit. A 50 year old applicant still has plenty of working life ahead of them.
This would most certainly help attract quality skills into our regional areas
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Monday, 20 July 2015
What can I Apply to immigration to Australia?
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Tuesday, 21 July 2015
It is interesting to read that RMAs are experiencing the same illogical and and non-commercial approach to s/c 457 Nominations and Visa applications.
We have experienced a Visa refusal because the Nomination had not yet been approved, yet it had been residing on a DIBP desk awaiting determination. NO review rights makes this refusal particularly galling.
The other point is the lack of knowledge of DIBP officers about industries and applying decisions bases on an erroneous understanding of basic business processes. Ignorance is applied in a devastating way for many of our applicants.
I have prepared a complaint to the Minister; and will also make a submission to the Global Feedback Unit, but not sure if this would be a futile waste of time. -
Tuesday, 21 July 2015
I have fallen into the habit of not lodging 457 visa applications until nomination is approved. Of course this is not an option if time with current visa is limited but sometimes better for client to be offshore awaiting lodgement of visa appln after approval of nomination. They will not thank you if they lose visa application fee/s for all applicants. My client is still waiting for refund from MRT for appeal application that was deemed invalid by Lee decision. Another awaits a decision for hearing that happened 6 weeks ago. Betting the member was one of those culled. Disgraceful!
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Tuesday, 21 July 2015
Would be a waste of time as they look after their own kind there. Need to make a complaint to someone outside of the Department, i.e Commonwealth Ombudsman. Ideally, an inquiry needs to be made into the Department and their hidden agendas.
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Tuesday, 21 July 2015
I am now advising clients to seriously consider applying to emigrate to live work and get PR/citizenship in Canada or another country that is more enlightened and has more transparent and logical/simpler processes and outcomes and generally more individual freedoms and a better 'feel' - and of course the migrants will nearly always be closer to their 'home' country and definitely closer to all parts of the 'real' civilized world.
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Tuesday, 21 July 2015
Morning John Roberts,
I have strongly held the vies that public servants are not astute business skilled individuals. My view is based on the numerous unsound and faulty inferences made by case officers that comes to my attention from other agents. Currently I am preparing a submission to the MRT emphasising my observation that public servants cocooned in their arm chair do not show the ability to think outside their narrow box of faulty inferences based on the regulations.
Immigration blog
Yes it is very high and many applicants struggle with this level 6 constantly, I think IELTS have made enough money now and whoever there investors are should be ashamed cause they are taking money continuously from people trying to reach this threshold, why are they giving the government the stats on how many time people are sitting the test, why have we not got the support of IELTS as a lobbyist group with us to assist these people or is it all about the money for them as well. so of the DIBP case officers are shocking with their English.